2024 Gold Cup

[AaronLad]

For the King George I assume ?

I love the horse and there's no question he still retains his ability, it's whether he's mentally sound these days.
His Ryanair run was borderline bizarre but yes he still put in a couple of other top class efforts.
I'll wait for the in running, but I will also consider an in running gold Cup bet too...

Yes for the king george.
I've actually gone off him for the gold cup , i dont think he likes cheltenham, as crazy as it sounds considering he's won a supreme, an arkle and came 2nd in a ryanair.
It doesn't mean i don't think he can win it, i'm just doubting he actually enjoys cheltenham, but kempton is a different story.

[Carnage at Taunton]

For the King George I assume ?

I love the horse and there's no question he still retains his ability, it's whether he's mentally sound these days.
His Ryanair run was borderline bizarre but yes he still put in a couple of other top class efforts.
I'll wait for the in running, but I will also consider an in running gold Cup bet too...

once they start thinking about it, which he has for a while now(he clearly was thinking in the QM) then just have to be wary of backing him. And to be fair to the horse, who could blame him after that effort in beating Energumene!!
That was a serious effort.

In running makes perfect sense to me if you think he’s still got the ability.
Ive cashed out my Gold Cup bet , but I have had a little dabble on the KG/GC double, just in case he sets off on Boxing Day, as I believe he’s still good enough to win this renewal.
I do fear he will do it again though.

[Rooster Booster]

Yes for the king george.
I've actually gone off him for the gold cup , i dont think he likes cheltenham, as crazy as it sounds considering he's won a supreme, an arkle and came 2nd in a ryanair.
It doesn't mean i don't think he can win it, i'm just doubting he actually enjoys cheltenham, but kempton is a different story.

It’s not crazy, said the same to a mate some months back. His wins have been despite not because

[Captain Chris]

I've pressed the button on The Real Whacker now I can get 75s (boosted) with William Hill. The top 3 in the market are about to joust it out today but are all in the right place. The only other horse I wanted to have onside from the beginning of the season is TRW.

I thought his King George run was alright and a step back in the right direction. So much pace on that he could never get his preferred position and I don't think he was suited by Kempton at all. That said, he plugged on well enough to only be beaten 10 lengths. I'd assume he'll head to trials day for the Cotswold Chase and I'd fancy him in that. Small field, set the fractions from the front and see if he stays the trip. If he does, an RSA winner isn't a 75s shot. I don't know what pace there will be in the big race itself so there's a chance he can get to the front then too and dictate.

I held off backing him at the start of the year expecting he'd do an Ahoy Senor and hit 40s after a couple of races that were never going to suit. I'm getting nearly double that now

[FinalFurlong91]

Monster performance from Galopin

Change in tactics worked the oracle

He runs like that in the gold cup nothing gets near him

[Atlantic Viking]

I'm not looking past GDC or Fastorslow at this point. One needs no introduction, the other has huge upside potential as the Wolf of Wall Street might say. Hasn't got the credit he deserves for his big win (in a race ran fairly) because 'Punchestown throws up funny results (unless it's a form boost to one they like) and the others had had a hard race at Cheltenham (unlike a handicap which are total processions and against the future National winner about 20lb well)'. Can't have Gerri Colombe, a one dimensional fighter with a proper padded out record.

Stopped clocks etc... Surprised by how far Gerri was off it however, but some performance from GDC. Also, whilst it'd have been a big surprise, still have to admit to some relief that IAM didn't get close, he caused enough damage to a wedge of NHC slips by being too good, one race is enough thankfully.

[Lobos]

Stunning performance. Absolutely brilliant. Gerri well and truly put in his place.

[Lobos]

If Gentlemansgame recovers in time from his slight injury and comes through his Cotswold Chase successfully then I expect him to be Robcours representative in the Gold Cup. He looks the EW value in the race at 25/1. After Gerri's hammering yesterday IMO they'll skip Cheltenham and save him for Aintree. If GDC turns up in March in the same form as yesterday though, no one will get near him.

[Carnage at Taunton]

Yes, very impressive from GDC.
However, March is another day and this race has plenty of mileage still imo.
Shishkin proved to me he’s a worthy contender and GC has proved to be much better than that yesterday.
We also have improved contenders like GMG and probably the one with the best claims Fastorslow.
Still fascinating and exciting race to
look forward to.

[AaronLad]

I absolutely love shishkin for the gold cup. I know he's not going to be everyone's cup of tea but he really does have a lot to like about him.
His first try over 3m+ at aintree, only beating ahoy senor a length and half people will say isn't gold cup winning form. However at the aintree festival the previous 2 seasons ahoy senor produced a 155 rpr in a novice hurdle and a 166 rpr in a novice chase beating the following seasons gold cup runner up (bravemansgame)by 30 lengths, both were impressive performances.
The way in which shishkin stayed on and produced a race winning jump at the final fence really impressed me.

Shishkin had an interrupted campaign last season, starting out over 2miles in the tingle creek clearly taken off his feet nowadays in top level 2mile races.
He then had wind surgery before re-appearing in the grade 1 ascot chase over 2m5f, producing a scintillating performance, demolishing pic d'ohry and fakir d'oudairies.
He was a little disappointing in the ryanair but still managed 2nd place staying on well. I think this performance can be excused and be a consequence of the wind surgery and his performance in that comeback at ascot, maybe cheltenham just came a little soon.

This season he's going to have a campaign fully focused on staying chases, firstly the betfair chase at haydock (hopefully) and then what nicky henderson has callled "our main objective" the king george at kempton. A track at which shishkin is unbeaten in 4 runs, 3 of which were chases he won by a combined 46 lengths. I think he's a banker for the king george this year, even if galopin takes up that entry.

I understand the doubts that will suraface regards his age, he will be 10 if he lines up in the 2024 gold cup but i am of the belief top class racehorses that need a bit further in time and haven't spent a career over 3miles still have the mileage left in the tank.
Don cossack, sholokhovs gold cup winner, was winning his gold cup in his 27th race under rules at the age of 9.
shishkin has had 17 races under rules, only 3 of them have been 2m4f+,
don cossack was having his 20th 2m4f+ race in his gold cup.

I think he's being hugely underestimated and by the end of boxing day could well be favourite for the gold cup.

Galopin was impressive yesterday and i'm happy i was wrong the gold cup last season may have left it's mark.

I've seen a few posts on here that have said nothing gets near him in march if he turns up in that form, i clearly disagree with this.

I had to go back on the above post from november, to remind myself why i had placed a bet on shishkin for the gold cup.

After his performance in the king george i actually find it bemusing knowledgeable members don't think he'd get near GDC.

Interestingly, for those that have forgotten Don cossack fell in the king george at the 2nd last, when running a good race, prior to winning the gold cup. The season before he had run in the ryanair, rallying on the run in to finish 3rd. The similarities with him and shishkin are very clear to me.

If shishkin had stood up in the king george he'd have won, on his seasonal re-appearance, something that's never been done. (happy to be corrected if this is wrong)
keep underestimating this superstar because i'm going to keep backing him all the way to march

[opatcho]

I backed Shishkin for the KG, mainly because I think he acts really well at Kempton (and Ascot)
Looking back, the times where Shiskin appears to 'struggle' or not 'look so impressive' have been

1) At Cheltenham
- Supreme, he made it extremely hard for himself that day
- Arkle - was a none event, nothing turned up that day
- QM - put it down to what ever, he didnt enjoy himself
- Ryanair - another run at Cheltenham where he didnt jump or travel well enough

2) At Aintree
- Looked lack when he went there after winning the arkle
- Made it hard for himself when beating Anoy Senor

For me, feels like Shishkin is better suited right handed, or on a flatter surface... or both.

He ran a huge race in the King George, but he is going to have to run up a 180 to win this renewal of the Gold Cup! I just cant see that happening

[Quevega]

I'm building a book on the gold Cup, but will not be backing Shishkin cos I think he's got no chance. IMO.

[AaronLad]

I backed Shishkin for the KG, mainly because I think he acts really well at Kempton (and Ascot)
Looking back, the times where Shiskin appears to 'struggle' or not 'look so impressive' have been

1) At Cheltenham
- Supreme, he made it extremely hard for himself that day
- Arkle - was a none event, nothing turned up that day
- QM - put it down to what ever, he didnt enjoy himself
- Ryanair - another run at Cheltenham where he didnt jump or travel well enough

2) At Aintree
- Looked lack when he went there after winning the arkle
- Made it hard for himself when beating Anoy Senor

For me, feels like Shishkin is better suited right handed, or on a flatter surface... or both.

He ran a huge race in the King George, but he is going to have to run up a 180 to win this renewal of the Gold Cup! I just cant see that happening

I agree with your analysis of his races where he hasn't looked comfortable etc. But he won 4 and finished 2nd in 5 of those 6 races. its what the real top horses do.
Just because he doesn't look comfortable at cheltenham doesn't mean he hasn't performed the rpr's of those races you've mentioned would probably paint a different picture, a 162 for his supreme and a 175 for his arkle win and a 175 for beating ahoy senor at his favourite stomping ground.
For a horse that jumps to his left, being better right handed is a non starter for me.
The two times he's been beaten at cheltenham were after ascot races (top class performances) and 1 was the dreaded 2nd run after wind surgery.

Do you think ascot is a flat track? because it's really not

[archie]

The 8/1 'archie double' looking in decent shape.

RPR of 184 for GDC, same as Gold Cup day.

The KG RPRs were
173 Hewick
172 Shishkin, BMG, Allaho

[Runragged]

The 8/1 'archie double' looking in decent shape.

RPR of 184 for GDC, same as Gold Cup day.

The KG RPRs were
173 Hewick
172 Shishkin, BMG, Allaho

Shishkin highest RPR is also 179 at Ascot, a track that seems to suit him so well. If he is to beat Galopin then it looks like it will need a career best from Shishkin at the age of 10 and Galopin to run below par.