2024 Champion Hurdle (Previously Constitution Hill thread)

[Istabraq]

If he got new challengers each season then I'd think it was great, especially if they were UK based.
Unfortunately I fear we'll have to wait for one race a season to have any real doubts (still odds on doubts) barring accidents of course.
Hopefully this is a bare minimum and the Irish keep throwing different challengers at him.
If it ends up as State Man vs CH every year then that will be pretty sad.

I think that's a view shared by plenty Quevega, personally I think it might be a little disrespectful to State Man who has a bunch of G1 wins to his name.
I remember the likes of Hurricane Fly winning 3 runner races at 5s on before winning champion hurdles, I know it's a cliche but the horse can only beat what's put in front of them.
Arkle suffered similarly, scared everyone off, didn't they even change the handicap system to try getting him beat ?
I can't imagine it was overly exciting watching him win a Gold Cup by 30l at 10s on but that doesn't change how talented the horse was.

I get the arguments against him swerving a chase career, but I am unsure why there's a perception that jumping fences is more credible than jumping timber...

[Quevega]

I can only speak for myself and rate both disciplines the same.
But If a horse could be a champion in both during his career then they would probably rank above "specialists" IMO.

[Bollinger]

Just as much risk Hurdling as there is Chasing. Especially at the top. That's been done to death before on here.
Reading your post just confirms to me how boring it would be if he stays Hurdling. We'd probably only see him twice a year before the festival every season as well and not again after. A waste of a supreme talent. Don't do it to the horse.

That's me done. Not another word on it. Makes me sad.

Sorry Lobos, I love your passion for this forum and respect your opinion, but I would have to totally disagree here. The risks of jumping a fence compared to a hurdle are much, much greater. I could write loads here honestly.

Just think if the Grand National was run over hurdles. Do you think 15 horses would fall every year and another 10 get pulled up?

Its really not even a discussion, in my humble opinion.

[Saxon Warrior]

Sorry Lobos, I love your passion for this forum and respect your opinion, but I would have to totally disagree here. The risks of jumping a fence compared to a hurdle are much, much greater. I could write loads here honestly.

Just think if the Grand National was run over hurdles. Do you think 15 horses would fall every year and another 10 get pulled up?

Its really not even a discussion, in my humble opinion.

And you have to jump around 50% more obstacles in a 2M Chase than in a 2M hurdle. (12 vs 8 on a lot of courses)

[Lobos]

I posted stats from Cheltenham races over a long period when we had this discussion before which showed there was very little difference in deaths of horses at the course in Hurdle races compared to Chase . Believe it or not, more are lost in their fields/training facilities than at the racecourse.

[HesTheOne]

I posted stats from Cheltenham races over a long period when we had this discussion before which showed there was very little difference in deaths of horses at the course in Hurdle races compared to Chase . Believe it or not, more are lost in their fields/training facilities than at the racecourse.

We’re injuries covered in that piece or just deaths only?

[Lobos]

We’re injuries covered in that piece or just deaths only?

Just deaths. Clearly keeping tabs with all injuries would be an impossible task.

Travelling quicker over Hurdles was a leveller

[Bollinger]

I posted stats from Cheltenham races over a long period when we had this discussion before which showed there was very little difference in deaths of horses at the course in Hurdle races compared to Chase . Believe it or not, more are lost in their fields/training facilities than at the racecourse.

It’s nothing to do with deaths.

How many horses fall over a fence as a ‘hurdle’??

How many horses fall over a hurdle as a ‘hurdle’??

And even more importantly, how many horses plough through a hurdle and continue through the race as though nothing’s happened???????

[Saxon Warrior]

It’s nothing to do with deaths.

How many horses fall over a fence as a ‘hurdle’??

How many horses fall over a hurdle as a ‘hurdle’??

And even more importantly, how many horses plough through a hurdle and continue through the race as though nothing’s happened???????

And due to those falls are
● injured,
● unable to race for long periods,
● never as good when they return from injury, or
● retired due to injury

[charlie]

these feels like a general chat topic fellas

[Spectre]

There seems to be a modern kind of snobery around hurdling, C Hill could go on to win 3 or 4 champion hurdles and be lauded the greatest hurdler of all time but for many it won't be enough because he didn't add G1 chases to his CV, chase championships seem (in the modern world) to have greater value than hurdling championships for some reason.
He's a special horse and one that could go unbeaten for five years, personally I think it should be celebrated whatever he achieves, but I don't have a financial position on him...

I couldn't agree with this more.

We've not really had what you'd call a Champion Hurlde rockstar since Istabraq. And that's a long time ago now. There is an obsession with horses going chasing. The Stayers is suffering from the same problem, and is a ridiculously weak division. Let's hope that changes this season.

I think Quevega makes a very good point though. Istabraq had Theatreworld chasing his backside round and his second and third Champion Hurdles were quite dull. Constitution Hill needs State Man, Vauban, and Impaire Et Passe this season, becuase they are infinitley better horses than Theatreworld was. Going for his third to equal Istabraq is slightly different, becuase we can all buy into the history being made, and if he happened to move onto a fourth with a winning chance, we just have to sit back and recognise that a special bit of history may unfold.

[Lobos]

these feels like a general chat topic fellas

Yeah, let's move on for Christ sake.....better things to discuss.

[Kautostar]

I couldn't agree with this more.

We've not really had what you'd call a Champion Hurlde rockstar since Istabraq. And that's a long time ago now. There is an obsession with horses going chasing. The Stayers is suffering from the same problem, and is a ridiculously weak division. Let's hope that changes this season.

I think Quevega makes a very good point though. Istabraq had Theatreworld chasing his backside round and his second and third Champion Hurdles were quite dull. Constitution Hill needs State Man, Vauban, and Impaire Et Passe this season, becuase they are infinitley better horses than Theatreworld was. Going for his third to equal Istabraq is slightly different, becuase we can all buy into the history being made, and if he happened to move onto a fourth with a winning chance, we just have to sit back and recognise that a special bit of history may unfold.

Not sure I’d agree with that. Ok istabraq was better but hardy eustace, hurricane fly, faugheen, Annie power and honeysuckle were all rockstar’s.

[Istabraq]

Not sure I’d agree with that. Ok istabraq was better but hardy eustace, hurricane fly, faugheen, Annie power and honeysuckle were all rockstar’s.

Finally some love for the hurdlers (party emoji).
Also throw the much criticised Buveur D’Air in there, to win two championships you have to be special…

[Kevloaf]

Kevloaf. Time for a poll Kev? Which race does CH run in?

It'd be 100% Champion Hurdle wouldn't it?