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2025 Novice Hurdlers

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  • ‘Is the Cheltenham Bumper form a reasonable guide to picking the following year’s Supreme and Gallagher novice hurdles winner?’

    That’s the question I have been thinking for a while, so today I thought I would look back through the years and races, particularly as so many pundits when being asked about the Supreme or Gallagher ante post winner for 2025, pick horses they have seen at either the Cheltenham bumper or the end of season Punchestown bumper.

    Whilst past performance isn’t the ‘be all and end all’ for forecasting the future, then it’s a pretty good starting point.

    The outcome from looking at past Bumper, Supreme and Gallagher winners is that maybe we should be looking elsewhere in making our ante post picks for the Supreme and Gallagher for 2025?

    In the last 20 or so years I can’t see a Cheltenham Bumper winner winning the following years Supreme, only one getting on the podium (Facile Vega)

    When looking at the Gallaghers then over the same period it is better, but not great……..Envoi Allen and Sir Gerhard but that’s it!

    So my take from the review is that we should look elsewhere for the Supreme winner and if looking at Jasmin De Vaux, Jason Doudaries, Romeo Coolio, The Yellow Clay or even Redemption Day then it should be Gallaghers only, even if the trainer says that they are a 2 miler (Romeo and The Yellow Clay)

    I would still though suggest that the percentage call is that the winner of both races didn’t run in either of the festival bumpers and that we should look elsewhere.

    Horses such as Salvador Mundi (following the Il Etait Temps route for the Supreme), Jeroboam Machin (beat Redemption day easily and surely has a fav chance for either race if fit?), Kopek Des Bordes, William Munny, Minella Premier and Harbour Highway should be on the shortlist methinks.

    Could Emmett make his mark on the festival winning the Supreme with Harbour Way and Jeroboam Machin in the Gallaghers?

    Would love to know whether Jeroboam Machin is healthy and ready for battle in the 2024/2025 season?














    Comment


    • Totally agree
      Ive never used the Bumper form for the following nov hurdles, can’t think of too many occasions I have regretted that.
      If I see a bumper horse jump hurdles well during the season I may change my view of course, but until I see them jump I take no notice of what they did in flat races.

      Comment


      • One bumper horse that could be of interest this season (I just don't know where) Is ROYAL INFANTRY trained by Dan Skelton. Finished 9th in the Champion Bumper but won a Newbury bumper in February that is a well trodden path for really good horses. Beuveur D'Air, Altior, Barters Hill, Ballyandy and I Like To Move It have all used that bumper. Royal Infantry beat Noahsgreatrainbow which is potentially a very smart one for Harry Derham.

        Comment


        • Originally posted by Wayward Lad View Post
          ‘Is the Cheltenham Bumper form a reasonable guide to picking the following year’s Supreme and Gallagher novice hurdles winner?’

          That’s the question I have been thinking for a while, so today I thought I would look back through the years and races, particularly as so many pundits when being asked about the Supreme or Gallagher ante post winner for 2025, pick horses they have seen at either the Cheltenham bumper or the end of season Punchestown bumper.

          Whilst past performance isn’t the ‘be all and end all’ for forecasting the future, then it’s a pretty good starting point.

          The outcome from looking at past Bumper, Supreme and Gallagher winners is that maybe we should be looking elsewhere in making our ante post picks for the Supreme and Gallagher for 2025?

          In the last 20 or so years I can’t see a Cheltenham Bumper winner winning the following years Supreme, only one getting on the podium (Facile Vega)

          When looking at the Gallaghers then over the same period it is better, but not great……..Envoi Allen and Sir Gerhard but that’s it!

          So my take from the review is that we should look elsewhere for the Supreme winner and if looking at Jasmin De Vaux, Jason Doudaries, Romeo Coolio, The Yellow Clay or even Redemption Day then it should be Gallaghers only, even if the trainer says that they are a 2 miler (Romeo and The Yellow Clay)

          I would still though suggest that the percentage call is that the winner of both races didn’t run in either of the festival bumpers and that we should look elsewhere.

          Horses such as Salvador Mundi (following the Il Etait Temps route for the Supreme), Jeroboam Machin (beat Redemption day easily and surely has a fav chance for either race if fit?), Kopek Des Bordes, William Munny, Minella Premier and Harbour Highway should be on the shortlist methinks.

          Could Emmett make his mark on the festival winning the Supreme with Harbour Way and Jeroboam Machin in the Gallaghers?

          Would love to know whether Jeroboam Machin is healthy and ready for battle in the 2024/2025 season?













          the thing is, times change, practice changes and therefore results and trends change. There’s a very different sort of bumper horse running now compared to even 10 years ago. The Cheltenham bumper is not a bad place to start. Out for the season rather than lack of ability is often a reason they don’t follow up.

          Comment


          • The other way to look at it is 2 of the last 5 Gallaghers winners won the bumper. 2 of the other 3 were rated 131+ in bumpers not racing in the Cheltenham bumper and unbeaten.

            ​​​​​IEP the odd one out.

            Leaves you with
            JDV
            Jeroboam Machin
            Whatever French bred Mullins has

            Comment


            • Ferny Hollow would have won the Supreme or Gallaghers as well but for injury.

              Comment


              • Champagne Fever won the Supreme and the Bumper. Montelado also doubled up after winning the first ever edition, becoming the only horse I know of to win consecutive races at the festival.

                Comment


                • I remember having this sort of chat about bumper winners around 6/7 years back, but since then the stats have definitely improved in favour of the bumper horses.
                  Even before then you had bumper winners going off short prices for the following years novice hurdles.
                  Cue Card, Dunguib, Cousin Vinny spring to mind.

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by Black Dog View Post
                    Champagne Fever won the Supreme and the Bumper. Montelado also doubled up after winning the first ever edition, becoming the only horse I know of to win consecutive races at the festival.
                    Thanks Black Dog…….not sure how I missed Champagne Fever?….the horse that nearly did the treble, getting mugged on the line in the Arkle!

                    I am also old enough to remember Monteldo, what a horse……and I thought he would win the following seasons Champ Hurdle before injury ended his career.

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by Wayward Lad View Post

                      I am also old enough to remember Monteldo, what a horse……and I thought he would win the following seasons Champ Hurdle before injury ended his career.
                      Are you not thinking of Monsignor ?
                      Won the bumper and then hacked up in his Ballymore/Gallaghers then had career ending injury...

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by Istabraq View Post

                        Are you not thinking of Monsignor ?
                        Won the bumper and then hacked up in his Ballymore/Gallaghers then had career ending injury...
                        Before Monsignor Istabraq…….over 30 years ago Montelado won the Bumper 1992 and then the Supreme in 1993……gives a clue as to old me and Black Dog are eh !

                        Comment


                        • Kawaboomga gets a good mention from Tony Mullins here

                          That 100/1 wont be around for long

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by Wayward Lad View Post

                            Before Monsignor Istabraq…….over 30 years ago Montelado won the Bumper 1992 and then the Supreme in 1993……gives a clue as to old me and Black Dog are eh !
                            Sadly I remember Montelado too I just remember Monsigner being a monster with the world at his feet whichever route they took, for some reason I don’t recall massive hype around Montelado…

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by darlojim View Post
                              Kawaboomga gets a good mention from Tony Mullins here

                              That 100/1 wont be around for long

                              https://x.com/AtTheRaces/status/1848804012390232186
                              Already been chopped

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by darlojim View Post
                                Kawaboomga gets a good mention from Tony Mullins here

                                That 100/1 wont be around for long

                                https://x.com/AtTheRaces/status/1848804012390232186
                                100/1 gone both supreme and ballymore

                                33s best now supreme
                                40s best ballymore

                                Comment

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