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And for those discussing Cheltenham cancelling or not.
It will depend on their insurance terms.
Ascot lost fuck all.
I believe Cheltenham have it fully covered so could essentially do what they please.
There’s a much wider picture Q, like owners, trainers and yard staff who share the prize money, breeders, not to mention bookies who will not only be forced to refund hundreds of millions of pounds they also miss out on their biggest week of the year and the sport relies on bookmakers so much of its’ sponsorship, no doubt ITV/RUK will be looking for refunds too....
There’s a much wider picture Q, like owners, trainers and yard staff who share the prize money, breeders, not to mention bookies who will not only be forced to refund hundreds of millions of pounds they also miss out on their biggest week of the year and the sport relies on bookmakers so much of its’ sponsorship, no doubt ITV/RUK will be looking for refunds too....
That was my point.
Ascot were able to play behind closed doors and were compensated for their own lost revenue.
I believe Cheltenham are the same.
But of course they could not run it at all.
The British Open Golf just fucked it off cos they didn't lose a penny.
They didn't care about nothing else.
Cheltenham have responsibilities here, huge responsibilities to the industry and to wider economies.
Obviously there won’t be 70,000 filling up the pubs, restaurants and hotels but even a smaller festival will require these on a smaller basis as well as media staff, owners and some members etc.
It’s a lovely romantic idea to think the whole thing could be cancelled because Irish and French horses might not be able to travel, but those who have this view I think need to consider the bigger picture...
The one thing in racing's favour is the large spaces it takes place in. Haven't really seen any news of virus break outs the way we've seen in rugby or football.
I'm not as invested as others due to my smaller stakes (I'd certainly miss it if I didn't get any of it back though), so it might be alright for me to pontificate, but it's completely outside of my control. No action I take has any real effect on it. I just accept my own significance.
A lot of chat about social media here and a good tip to give to anyone struggling - mute and lists. There are a few topics that I proper doomscroll about so I mute the key words in my account and I simply never see them. A few accounts that always got a reaction from me, mute them too.
Then I make lists of the topics I find it interesting for - racing, fantasy football, QPR - of good accounts with content I want to see. I then bookmark the list. So I'll specifically click in to check on racing etc and just get good stuff I want to see.
For all those having problems viewing historic Open bets with William Hill.
See below the response I received this morning from William Hill. Suggest you try the steps they have outlined below and if this doesn't work then e mail them with the details. support@willhill.com
There are a number of points they have specifically chosen not to respond to but I'm going to see whether their suggestions about reinstalling the App and clearing the cache work before escalating further.
"This is Georgina from William Hill I hope you have a great day Sorry for the delay response.
First Sorry on this technical matters But like what I've always said even if the amount you see is incorrect it will still be settled using your correct odds and the potential winning you should get from us .
We already raised this issue to our technical team but there sometimes it is not so easy and taking long to resolve everything.
I sincere apologies for this inconvenience has caused for you we already received the same error you got from other customer as well but they tried to do basic trouble shooting and all works fine I suggest for now to follow this procedure.
If via browser:
Log out from your account>clear cache>restart device>login and try again. You can also try another browser.
*If via app:
Log out of the account>uninstall the app>clear cache>restart device>re-install app and try again.
For all those having problems viewing historic Open bets with William Hill.
See below the response I received this morning from William Hill. Suggest you try the steps they have outlined below and if this doesn't work then e mail them with the details. support@willhill.com
There are a number of points they have specifically chosen not to respond to but I'm going to see whether their suggestions about reinstalling the App and clearing the cache work before escalating further.
"This is Georgina from William Hill I hope you have a great day Sorry for the delay response.
First Sorry on this technical matters But like what I've always said even if the amount you see is incorrect it will still be settled using your correct odds and the potential winning you should get from us .
We already raised this issue to our technical team but there sometimes it is not so easy and taking long to resolve everything.
I sincere apologies for this inconvenience has caused for you we already received the same error you got from other customer as well but they tried to do basic trouble shooting and all works fine I suggest for now to follow this procedure.
If via browser:
Log out from your account>clear cache>restart device>login and try again. You can also try another browser.
*If via app:
Log out of the account>uninstall the app>clear cache>restart device>re-install app and try again.
If it still not working I recommend to reply to us and provide this details to : support@willhill.com
1.operating system
2.Brand and device you are try to used.
3.Internet Provider.
4.Screen shot if you have.
Once we've got those information we will try to escalate this to our technical team."
That’s a staggering response NW, with the risk of sounding slightly racist that is straight from the outsourced Delhi call centre, incredible how Hills have allowed that response that carries their name to be provided....
That was my point.
Ascot were able to play behind closed doors and were compensated for their own lost revenue.
I believe Cheltenham are the same.
But of course they could not run it at all.
The British Open Golf just fucked it off cos they didn't lose a penny.
They didn't care about nothing else.
Though I can’t quote specific figures Mr Quevega, I would have to disagree a touch with your statement about Ascot being ‘compensated for their own lost revenue’.
I vividly remember during Champions Day in October they interviewed Guy Henderson, Chief Exec of Ascot racecourse and he clearly stated that more than 70% of Ascot’s revenues and 50% of its profits had been lost in 2020 due to the pandemic. He also stated that revenues will likely be severely affected ‘until 2022 at the earliest’. There is an article in the Racing Post dated Dec 16th that also covers this, and the lost revenues.
To my knowledge, the only sporting institution/company that had the foresight to employ insurance for a pandemic was Wimbledon. And even with an estimated turnover annually of ?250 million for the fortnight, the insurance only covered them for ?114 million of potential lost earnings.
I cannot recollect any other sporting organisations being publically quoted as having this type of insurance, and it’s why the Wimbledon story stood out like a beacon.
Ascot I believe did take out a pandemic insurance policy post Royal Ascot (unbelievable that it was still even available!) that has covered them for the last 6 months of 2020, but the loss of earnings for Royal Ascot were not. That’s my belief.
Apologies for hogging this thread with this topic once more, as I fully appreciate that it doesn't impact the majority. Hopefully this will be my last post on this until we receive a positive response regarding a fix.
For all those having problems viewing historic Open bets with William Hill.
So the workarounds suggested by William Hill didn't work for me and as stated by Istabraq the response I received was lets be charitable here, extremely amateurish.
I have replied far more fully but main points copied below. I have omitted the info re the workarounds, devices and screenshots etc.
"Thank you for your response, although frankly I was appalled by the statements made about your technical team. Please can you refer this to a Senior Manager within the William Hill Support Team because you have not answered many of the points I have raised.
Based on the statements made in your reply, I don't consider that William Hill appears to be taking this matter seriously at all. As stated before, this should be a high priority fault with documented fault finding and fix activities, along with a target timescale for resolution.
For you to state in a reply to a customer that it 'is not easy' to resolve a technical problem is astonishing. William Hill is one of the UKs premier on-line betting companies and an established FTSE high profile company. Your Application and technical support team should be first class otherwise you should not be in this business.
As I emphasised in my previous e mail, I want to be able to use the William Hill App which you provide support and promote, to view and reconcile my Open bets with full confidence that I can see every single one of them accurately and completely.
For information, I have shared your response with similarly impacted users and if the steps you have suggested also don't work for them, then I expect you are likely to receive a flurry of e mails on the same subject.
Currently, I'm sorry to say that my confidence in the William Hill App and support for it has been further diminished by your reply.
I look forward to receiving a much more constructive and positive response to this e mail, now that you know the proposed App workarounds did not work on my 2 devices"
PS: I nearly sent them the picture of the Ostrich with its head in the sand but thought that might be a bit too flippant!
Though I can’t quote specific figures Mr Quevega, I would have to disagree a touch with your statement about Ascot being ‘compensated for their own lost revenue’.
I vividly remember during Champions Day in October they interviewed Guy Henderson, Chief Exec of Ascot racecourse and he clearly stated that more than 70% of Ascot’s revenues and 50% of its profits had been lost in 2020 due to the pandemic. He also stated that revenues will likely be severely affected ‘until 2022 at the earliest’. There is an article in the Racing Post dated Dec 16th that also covers this, and the lost revenues.
To my knowledge, the only sporting institution/company that had the foresight to employ insurance for a pandemic was Wimbledon. And even with an estimated turnover annually of ?250 million for the fortnight, the insurance only covered them for ?114 million of potential lost earnings.
I cannot recollect any other sporting organisations being publically quoted as having this type of insurance, and it’s why the Wimbledon story stood out like a beacon.
Ascot I believe did take out a pandemic insurance policy post Royal Ascot (unbelievable that it was still even available!) that has covered them for the last 6 months of 2020, but the loss of earnings for Royal Ascot were not. That’s my belief.
I forgot about Wimbledon.
Obviously insurance will only payout certain specified amounts, they are generally not designed to provide profits, although loss of earnings would come into this. Most insurances would be to cover costs, losses and other contingencies.
My understanding was that Ascot had some cover towards their costs, for the Royal meeting, but I could certainly be mistaken.
With regards the comments in October, I'd expect that Ascot (along with all hospitality based businesses) would of course have lost revenue, and especially with regards other meetings and events the course would have normally been able to conduct.
A random thought for a Monday night. There’s been a lot of comments over the last couple of months about how trainers should provide fast and efficient comms on the fitness of their horses if one has suffered some form of misfortune which may keep the horse out for an extended period. While I completely get the reasoning for this argument and the integrity of the sport is there not also a case of us dedicated punters being careful what we wish for?
What I mean of course is if something is drip fed by stable sources / Twitter / markets drifts such as Ferny Hollow it gives the dedicated punter plenty of time to make a decision to cash out where as official comms requires a fair bit of fortune in being able to cash out before the bookie suspends. I can’t help but feel the drip drip approach works more in our favour??
As I mentioned above, these individual instances might cumulatively tip the scales. The latest to make the news is the Celtic trip to Dubai, where Nicola Sturgeon is clearly taking a dim view as reported in the Scottish media:
'There could also be wider consequences as Nicola Sturgeon had questioned the purpose of Celtic's trip and whether they were following social-distancing rules after seeing photos from their Dubai base.
The First Minister subsequently warned that professional sport's privileges could be lost if protocols were not followed by all participants'.
I think it’s very much worth saying that it’s a bit disgraceful seeing all these sports stars and celebrities flying off to Dubai in the middle of a pandemic. And then coming back and living their lives. Doesn’t sit right for me whilst the rest of us are in lockdown.
Just me or anyone else have nightmares about the 'Out For The Festival Thread'
I can't be the only one surely!
Every time it's updated I nervously click thinking 'here we go' then I dodge the bullet and it doesn't affect me. Waiting for the day when it does. It's coming. Gonna be open door bullet to the head kind of job.
Have a sneaky feeling we've in for a rough week re out for fez news.
Just me or anyone else have nightmares about the 'Out For The Festival Thread'
I can't be the only one surely!
Every time it's updated I nervously click thinking 'here we go' then I dodge the bullet and it doesn't affect me. Waiting for the day when it does. It's coming. Gonna be open door bullet to the head kind of job.
Have a sneaky feeling we've in for a rough week re out for fez news.
tbh nothing beats the retrospective pain of that thread. Had Le Richebourg and DDS in an 87/1 double back in 2019. Was on course when Defi won and was celebrating and suddenly remember the page loading "Kevin Blake say Le Richebourg is out for the season" and had a huge hello darkness my old friend moment
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