General Chat

[Topofthegame2021]

I get your angle on Chantry House but I’m struggling to see how APT is well exposed over the Gold Cup trip…

Well exposed was probably the wrong choice of language in hindsight.

His profile doesn’t really fit into my thought process of a Gold Cup winner. Saying that, he’s achieved alot in his career and he’s still only 7 years old.

As Saxon says his two starts at 3miles + have been impressive.

I will have to have a look over it to potentially add to the book

[Istabraq]

Well exposed was probably the wrong choice of language in hindsight.

His profile doesn’t really fit into my thought process of a Gold Cup winner. Saying that, he’s achieved alot in his career and he’s still only 7 years old.

As Saxon says his two starts at 3miles + have been impressive.

I will have to have a look over it to potentially add to the book

The beauty of this forum, having a pre-determined view changed by knowledgable members.

Re Chantry House I’ll make a very ignorant comment but I think he’ll fall short of top table, he make take one or two good contests over here but when the Irish battalion land I think he’ll be short.
No solid argument why just a personal view but I’d be happy to be educated and proved wrong…

[Lbur4288]

The beauty of this forum, having a pre-determined view changed by knowledgable members.

Re Chantry House I’ll make a very ignorant comment but I think he’ll fall short of top table, he make take one or two good contests over here but when the Irish battalion land I think he’ll be short.
No solid argument why just a personal view but I’d be happy to be educated and proved wrong…

It sounds silly to say about a horse that won 2 grade 1 races this year but both times I felt Chantry House massively rode his luck. Obviously Envoi Allen falling in the Marsh was a huge help, had he been given the same prep as previous years I don't think that would have happened and the remainder of the field aren't even being mentioned for grade 1 bets this time.

And then we have Aintree, I feel Espoir de Romay was travelling best and would have won handsomely but for falling. The Gold cup field will be better than anything Chantry House has encountered before and even if one of the class horses falls...there will be others in the field that will likely finish ahead of CH.

Just my opinion on course but not one I'm rushing to get in my book (I have backed A Plus Tard a fair bit).

[FinalFurlong91]

Chantry House is a horse iv never taken too

I just dont think he has the latent talent to win a gold cup

Feel hed need to improve a good bit

[Saxon Warrior]

It sounds silly to say about a horse that won 2 grade 1 races this year but both times I felt Chantry House massively rode his luck. Obviously Envoi Allen falling in the Marsh was a huge help, had he been given the same prep as previous years I don't think that would have happened and the remainder of the field aren't even being mentioned for grade 1 bets this time.

And then we have Aintree, I feel Espoir de Romay was travelling best and would have won handsomely but for falling. The Gold cup field will be better than anything Chantry House has encountered before and even if one of the class horses falls...there will be others in the field that will likely finish ahead of CH.

Just my opinion on course but not one I'm rushing to get in my book (I have backed A Plus Tard a fair bit).

I think that no horse encounters a field of horses as good as a Gold Cup field, until the first day they run in the Gold Cup.

My view on that, is I would rather have a horse running in his first season out of novice company, as my biggest Gold Cup bet(s) as they tend to be be more prolific winners of the Gold Cup, than those who have had two or more seasons chasing.

I know Envoi Allen is very good, but I’m not putting him as a clear Marsh winner last March, when assessing this season.
He fell early, I don’t know how he would have performed.

On his three completed Chase starts, all were really good quality, with a best RPR of 165.

Chantry House was rated RPR 165 for winning the Marsh, so at present that suggests a photo finish if Envoi Allen had stood up and ran to his prior best.

I neither agree or disagree with that comment above, just note that the ratings of the two were identical.

Chantry House improved his RPR to 167 on his next/last start, in a Grade 1 win on his first start over 3M (3M1F), with Espoir De Romay also awarded an RPR of 167 after falling 2 out, upsides Chantry House.

CH may be lucky that the two most likely candidates to beat him, in his two Grade 1’s, both fell, or he may not.

At the moment I would judge him as only behind Monkfish (RPR 170, identical to Asterion Forlonge, but over 3M) on the list of Novices going open Grade 1 chasing over 3M, until others put up better performances and ratings.

Asterion Forlonge went from third in the Marsh to winning a Graded Handicap at the mid-trip at an RPR of 170.
Willie was very pleased, with the performance and can’t wait to see him again this season, according to post-race comments at Punchestown.

Honestly I wouldn’t discount all of those mentioned above as being able to step up to Gold Cup 2022 standard.

There’s no gut feeling for or against any of them making the required 10lb improvement to be lethal in a Gold Cup.
They are all capable until they prove otherwise.

Its easy to love the Minella Indo and A Plus Tard performances in March they were both wonderful.

Though I am not putting them on a pedestal and saying they’ve done it already so the new kids on the block can’t knock them over, as they usually manage to - it’s just spotting which one it will be.

Performing well at Cheltenham is usually a decent marker for a future Gold Cup horse, but it’s not imperative for them to have won at a Festival before.

[Lobos]

I too feel Chantry House will be found out in top company over 3m+ and will revert to the Ryanair. As for Asterion Forlonge......get that big black marker pen and run it right through him. He will not be running again at Cheltenham imo or on any other Left handed track for that matter. He'll stick to going the other way and the King George will be his top target this coming season. He's absolutely made for that race and if Mullins doesn't send him there I'll eat his Trilby.

[Lobos]

I know I keep beating the same drum but anyone who fancies Monkfish to win the Gold Cup just can't ignore Elimay. Monkfish rated 163 and Elimay rated 155. Take into account the 7lb Mares allowance and there's 1lb between them. She looks like she'll stay all day long so the step up will suit. We know she handles Cheltenham and the big occasion, she jumps for fun and she's as game as they come. 6/1 v 40/1. No more comments your honour.

[Saxon Warrior]

I too feel Chantry House will be found out in top company over 3m+ and will revert to the Ryanair. As for Asterion Forlonge......get that big black marker pen and run it right through him. He will not be running again at Cheltenham imo or on any other Left handed track for that matter. He'll stick to going the other way and the King George will be his top target this coming season. He's absolutely made for that race and if Mullins doesn't send him there I'll eat his Trilby.

Stop sitting on the fence

[archie]

I've an open mind on Chantry House but I'm convinced that A Plus Tard won't win the Gold Cup. He's a worthy candidate for a book, especially each way, but his G1 win was gained by the jockey's excessive use of the whip and, having had 3 more chases than Minella Indo, there's no reason for him to turn this year's form around, never mind beat the new kids on the block.

[Lobos]

Stop sitting on the fence

Can't do that....I've got a boney arse !

[Saxon Warrior]

I know I keep beating the same drum but anyone who fancies Monkfish to win the Gold Cup just can't ignore Elimay. Monkfish rated 163 and Elimay rated 155. Take into account the 7lb Mares allowance and there's 1lb between them. She looks like she'll stay all day long so the step up will suit. We know she handles Cheltenham and the big occasion, she jumps for fun and she's as game as they come. 9/2 v 40/1. No more comments your honour.

I am not sure she would stay 3M2.5F well enough.

She could do, though, and until she tries it cannot be completely discounted, but I would be with all of those mentioned in my post above, being potentially better over 3M than Elimay, at the moment.

…….and Elimay can win the Mares Chase for Willie and JP.

[FinalFurlong91]

Thing with envoi is due to his injury and the fall he was never given the chance to run to a big figure

We still don't really know how good he is

Monkfish seemed to feel the effects of some pretty hard races against latest exhibition at both Cheltenham and Punchestown

He didnt seem to have the same zest and exuberance about him, plus there was the rumours about the back injury

It will be fascinating to see how they match up with minella indo and a plus tard

[FinalFurlong91]

I've an open mind on Chantry House but I'm convinced that A Plus Tard won't win the Gold Cup. He's a worthy candidate for a book, especially each way, but his G1 win was gained by the jockey's excessive use of the whip and, having had 3 more chases than Minella Indo, there's no reason for him to turn this year's form around, never mind beat the new kids on the block.

To have any chance he needs to improve his jumping

I rewatched the race the other day and minella indo was making ground at every fence

A plus tard was too slow away from his fences, which also cost him in the previous years ryanair

[Lobos]

I am not sure she would stay 3M2.5F well enough.

She could do, though, and until she tries it cannot be completely discounted, but I would be with all of those mentioned in my post above, being potentially better over 3M than Elimay, at the moment.

…….and Elimay can win the Mares Chase for Willie and JP.

Mares Chase over a Gold Cup......yuk !! I'll keep beating the drum........

[Atlantic Viking]

If you want a horse to pick up the pieces when everyone else has lost the plot, then Chantry House is the man. Hard to back on merit but his voodoo doll game in the build up to races is not to be underestimated.