2022 Ballymore Novices Hurdle

[Quevega]

It’ll depend on the ground I reckon
be a bad decision to run him in the ballymore on normal spring ground
not classy enough

[Kevloaf]

It’ll depend on the ground I reckon
be a bad decision to run him in the ballymore on normal spring ground
not classy enough

What have you got so far this season that's

A) Potential to be classier
B) Has shown anything classier

And then C) how classy do you need to be to win this race?

[Craigy14]

I suspect when they reflect upon it, now that they’ve seen Ginto can win a grade 1 over 2m 4f they’ll opt for the Ballymore and adopt similar front running tactics. I think the extra furlong of the Ballymore coupled with the Cheltenham hill will seem them go down this route. That leaves Hollow Games for the AB and enables them to split their horses. I suspect HG will be given too high a mark for a handicap.

Yeah definitely agree with this, Hollow Games has finished 4 lengths back in a Grade 1 and already won a Grade 3, there’s only one mark he’d have in the Pipe and that’s top weight. He just doesn’t have the pace for 2 and a half for me either, given the ground normally better by the end of the week too.

Ginto should rightfully go for this imo, he’s looked the best so far from what we have to go on.

Supreme Three Stripe Life, Mighty Potter
Ballymore Ginto possibly Gerri
Albert Bartlett Hollow Games possibly Gerri

Thats some solid horses from what we’ve seen to date. We know WPM is late to the party but they set a reasonable standard imo for Gordon, fairly strong team.

[JackieMoon33]

After todays beating of Hollow Games, I think they’ll aim Ginto at the race they most think he can win and then Hollow Games fits in around him. As much as it pains me to say it, I’d not be confident Hollow Games would reverse the form over further.

Just because Ginto won over 2m4f today it’s not a given he'll go to the Ballymore as Gordon has aimed his winners of the Lawlors at both the Ballymore and AB before.

Gerri Colombe could influence the decision if he puts in a big performance (I really think he’s way better than a ‘capper and different owners) and I’d also think that one (or maybe both) of Three Stripe Life and Mighty Potter could step up to the Ballymore trip too. I know they both ran well over 2m but that’s a very strong division and depending on how they fare next time out (I assume both will run again), they could divert from the Supreme.

I’m not sure that has made sense other than it’s still a minefield for which of Gordon’s runners will run where.

From a JWM perspective, Grand Jury’s run should push JWM further towards the AB. Grand Jury travelled into the straight well but didn’t finish his race off. That could be due to Ginto being better or a reflection of Henry’s horses being a bit dicky at present and not seeing out their races.

[Brooksie]

I feel Gordon wants to keep Gerri and Ginto apart, Noticed the other day that someone stated Gordon was hinting at stepping Gerri up in trip, not sure if it was in this thread or the AB thread. Which would suggest maybe 2'6 DRF, but obviously Robcour have Journey with me that could also slot in in that race. I know people are adamant JWM to the Bartlett, but I could see Gordon persuading them to rethink.

As I see things Gordon's probably Mighty Potter and Three Stripe Life Supreme, Ginto Ballymore, Hollow Games and Gerri AB.

[Studfarm254]

After todays beating of Hollow Games, I think they’ll aim Ginto at the race they most think he can win and then Hollow Games fits in around him. As much as it pains me to say it, I’d not be confident Hollow Games would reverse the form over further.

Just because Ginto won over 2m4f today it’s not a given he'll go to the Ballymore as Gordon has aimed his winners of the Lawlors at both the Ballymore and AB before.

Gerri Colombe could influence the decision if he puts in a big performance (I really think he’s way better than a ‘capper and different owners) and I’d also think that one (or maybe both) of Three Stripe Life and Mighty Potter could step up to the Ballymore trip too. I know they both ran well over 2m but that’s a very strong division and depending on how they fare next time out (I assume both will run again), they could divert from the Supreme.

I’m not sure that has made sense other than it’s still a minefield for which of Gordon’s runners will run where.

From a JWM perspective, Grand Jury’s run should push JWM further towards the AB. Grand Jury travelled into the straight well but didn’t finish his race off. That could be due to Ginto being better or a reflection of Henry’s horses being a bit dicky at present and not seeing out their races.

Agree with most of this. Was doing a bit of digging. Only horse I can see that he’s ran in the AB in years that hadn’t gone over at least 2 mile 6 before going into the race is death duty. It also won the lawlors and was sent straight to the AB as 13/8 favourite where it got absolutely tanked before unseating at the last. Given this route didn’t pay off and he hasn’t tried it since, I’d say knowing Gordon he’d be reluctant to try it again and surely has to go ballymore where it’s worked before

[thorne365]

i cant see how Ginto goes AB - going straight there and all runs over 2m4f or less - yes you can argue about improving for a trip etc but zero proof! Regardless of others i'd be 90% Ballymore

[Cashew King]

i cant see how Ginto goes AB - going straight there and all runs over 2m4f or less - yes you can argue about improving for a trip etc but zero proof! Regardless of others i'd be 90% Ballymore

Not sure how you can’t see him going to AB “I think he’ll stay further, I think all he does is stay. We had to stretch them and if it turned into a sprint it wouldn’t have worked.”

If all he does is “stay” and “if it turned into a sprint it wouldn’t have worked” - for me there’s every possibility of him going AB - but think it will depend on ground & what it looks likes going where after DRF before anything’s nailed down- IMO

[Madmoose]

Grand Jury and Gerri Colombe could both come here with Rachael and Davy riding each one, Jack on Ginto.

Hopefully happens for JWM and a Hollow Games going AB

[Quevega]

What have you got so far this season that's

A) Potential to be classier
B) Has shown anything classier

And then C) how classy do you need to be to win this race?

A classy horse can win at the top level over most trips
that’s my definition anyway.

kauto was classy
don cossack wasn’t

both brill horses but one was classier

not sure on a and b and busy at moment
but he’s not quick enough to win a ballymore on good to soft IMO.

soft or worse and he’s a good chance for sure

[thorne365]

Not sure how you can’t see him going to AB “I think he’ll stay further, I think all he does is stay. We had to stretch them and if it turned into a sprint it wouldn’t have worked.”

If all he does is “stay” and “if it turned into a sprint it wouldn’t have worked” - for me there’s every possibility of him going AB - but think it will depend on ground & what it looks likes going where after DRF before anything’s nailed down- IMO

by my calcs GE has had 9 runners in the AB since 2016 and only 1 hasnt run more than 2m4f beforehand - death duty. That was in 2017 and [imo] seems to have made his mind up around suitability of runners. Happy to change my 90% to 95%

[ComplyOrDie]

i cant see how Ginto goes AB - going straight there and all runs over 2m4f or less - yes you can argue about improving for a trip etc but zero proof! Regardless of others i'd be 90% Ballymore

It's a fair point and a risk surely Gordon wouldn't take. He'd at least want him over 2m6f prior to the festival. The last three seasons all his runners had run over 2m6f prior to the Bartlett.

[ComplyOrDie]

It obviously may equate to absolutely nothing, as he's done plenty of racing since his p2p, but my notes about Ginto was he ran a pretty quick p2p in comparison to others on the day, suggesting he actually doesn't lack pace, although he can clearly stay the intermediate trip really well too, as he has already shown.

[Benjy23]

A lot of mentions for Classic Getaway on the last couple of pages but he's another that could easily be a AB horse isn't he? Even his bumper win was over 2m 4f. And it seems his hurdle debut will be as well. I'd definitely like some form over shorter before stepping up for this.

Will rewatch the Lawlors later but Ginto seems stronger in the AB market than this one. Anything said on Grand Jury after the race by HDB? Fair run you'd think under the circumstances...

[Muswell]

Getaway has a horrible record at HQ doesn’t he?