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Has anyone had a Cheltenham 2022 punt yet

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  • That's precisely the point Saxon Warrior. If the Cheltenham Festival is going to host handicaps at the sports premier event then the prizemoney should reflect that. If not, and 'racing can't afford it' take them away and go back to a three day Festival. UK racing has been falling backwards compared to Ireland and France for a decade, so why not let Punchestown emerge as the sport's primary Festival too!

    Ireland is a Country where both the Government and the Sport is prepared to invest to be succesful. The UK on the other hand made it's first stab at reforming the levy for 56 years in 2017 (yes 56 years!!!!), and it was a mediocre effort after the bleating and threats from the bookmakers. Now it's time to review it again and do the job thoroughly and properly, to ensure the bookies pay up from their Gibraltar tax havens. The Levy and the bookmakers are almost entirely the reason that UK Racing is lagging behind, and Racing and the Government are allowing it to happen, and have been for far too long.

    For anyone that thinks the problem is something else, or there isn't an issue, it's easy to show how UK racing has fallen behind every major racing country in the world. The average prizemoeny in UK racing is 25% less than Ireland, and 33% less than France, and that's becuase betting turnover returned to racing by the Levy is 0.6% in the UK, and by comparison it's 1.5% in Ireland, and a whopping 8.8% in France. That leads to the huge difference to what we currently see that's invested in prizemoney, and racing as a whole. The disparity is so wide, it's little wonder that many big Irish owners are choosing to stay at home to contest their own races rather than head over here in March. It's also little wonder that the best horses are being snapped up at the sales and going to Irish trainers, and UK trainers find it increasingly hard to compete.

    It's not just the Irish owners and trainers swerving some of the races at the Festival because of prizemoney issues though. Paul Nicholls is increasingly swerving it and aiming at Aintree for 'softer' races instead because he sees this as the best chance of getting big races on board. He wasn't the only trainer to do it either. But if the prizemoney were sufficient at Cheltenham I doubt very much that he or anyone else would be able to convince owners to swerve the chance of a Festival winner. The very fact that UK owners and trainers are choosing to go to Aintree instead is the the most damning thing of all for where Cheltenham prizemoney sits, and just how damaging the overall lack of money in UK Racing is.

    And this is tip of the iceberg stuff. I have a number of friends in the UK who have scaled back, and others that have pulled out completely, whereas my Irish friends are chomping at the bit for the upcoming Goffs Landrover Sale. The lack of prizemoney here is a huge problem, and the inability to compete with owners and trainers from Ireland in the sales ring is compounding the problem. And ultimmately it manifests itself with Great Britain 5 Ireland 23, with Irish trainers also able to leave ammunition at home for better prizemoney. The UK is getting smashed in every way imaginable now, and the only fix is to get signifcantly more money into the game, or the slippery slope will become terminal.

    As I said, the issue we have here is that the majority of racing income comes from the levy, and the precentage coming directly back into racing is palpably not enough. 0.6% is embarrassingly low compared to other racing jurisdictions. The horse racing industry is far too weak in its stance with the bookmakers, and we lag far behind the rest of the world because of this specific issue. Racing needs to engage better with Goverment to push back hard against the bookmakers to do what they absoutely should do. And that's to make sure UK Racing operates on an even footing with the rest of the world, by taking it's fair share from the bookmakers who rely on it taking place to boost their swollen tax haven profits.

    Poor prizemoney in the Cheltenham handicaps is a symptom of a much bigger issue, and the answer here is not about concentrating prizemoney in a few pots, it's about fixing all the pots by solving the levy issue. But in the meantime before it's all fixed, UK Racing has to ensure the centrepiece of the jumps calrendar doesn't lose it's crown to other Festivals in Ireland. If it does, and there's a very real danger of that right now, there won't be a chance to turn the clock back. Punchestown and Leopardstown will already have stolen the crown and will keep it for themsleves.
    Last edited by Spectre; 3 June 2021, 09:46 AM.
    Luck is a dividend of sweat. The more I sweat, the luckier I get.

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    • Originally posted by Saxon Warrior View Post
      I don’t think ‘handicap prize money’ vs ‘punters attending the races’ - was an argument anyone was trying to put up - unless I am wrong (and I could be)

      For me it’s

      * do they want the handicaps to be average for the Grade, and used as fillers in between the Grade 1’s,
      Or
      * do they want each handicap to be the best in its Grade (like the Grade 1’s are)?


      Looking at the prize money for some of the Festival handicaps, it does look like they’re using some of the handicap races as fillers, between the Grade 1’s.

      Thats okay if that’s the aim, but if the aim is to have the best handicap hurdles and handicap chases at the Festival then it’s going to cost them a bit more in prize money to get to that place.

      Its more a thought and talking point - definitely not a dissing of the Jockey Club.
      It's a perfectly valid point of view, SW. I just think that the place for the top handicaps is as feature races at other meetings and increasing the prize-money for Festival handicaps returns nothing to benefit racing. The betting turnover (and therefore, the Levy) will be no greater and spreading the money more evenly around the lesser meetings and races means that smaller owners and trainers are more likely to stay in the game.

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      • ….Sky offer; bet on England game and get a free ?5 on any sport.

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        • Originally posted by somer1 View Post
          Just chucked a couple of free bets at American Mike any race 20/1 with Skybet. Won its ptp on the 10th Apr (3m) by 20l when with Monbeg Partnerships and since sold to the Moran's at the Tattersalls Cheltenham April sale for 195k and gone to Gordon Elliott's.
          Something about this horse that is pulling me in. Just asked WH,SKY,Coral,365 for a price on the spuds race next year even though 5yo's dont have a good record in this race.
          Found the video of AM winning its PTP today but couldnt watch as needed to log in and wasnt a member so if anyone could post it would be more than happy..
          Last edited by somer1; 7 July 2021, 10:21 AM.

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          • Originally posted by Eggs View Post
            ….Sky offer; bet on England game and get a free ?5 on any sport.
            Cant find that one.Just seen why im a month to late
            Last edited by somer1; 7 July 2021, 10:52 AM.

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            • Originally posted by somer1 View Post

              Cant find that one.Just seen why im a month to late
              …free ?10 bet with 365 on tonight’s game.

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              • Originally posted by somer1 View Post

                Something about this horse that is pulling me in. Just asked WH,SKY,Coral,365 for a price on the spuds race next year even though 5yo's dont have a good record in this race.
                Found the video of AM winning its PTP today but couldnt watch as needed to log in and wasnt a member so if anyone could post it would be more than happy..
                UPDATE.........
                365. Sorry we are unable to give a price on that selection.
                Coral. 25/1 Thinks that's crap as on at 20s any race with Sky.
                Sky 25/1
                WH 25/1
                Looks like im going to keep chipping away at any race.
                Last edited by somer1; 7 July 2021, 12:47 PM.

                Comment


                • Originally posted by somer1 View Post
                  Just chucked a couple of free bets at American Mike any race 20/1 with Skybet. Won its ptp on the 10th Apr (3m) by 20l when with Monbeg Partnerships and since sold to the Moran's at the Tattersalls Cheltenham April sale for 195k and gone to Gordon Elliott's.
                  not sure if this one will see a hurdle this season , bumpers certainly , but is a staying chaser , i have a little video of his PTP but not sure how to get it on here
                  Last edited by The Fellow; 18 July 2021, 10:45 AM.

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                  • Who does everyone think is the most solid looking double/handful of doubles at the current prices (ignoring what you may have on already)

                    as a doubles man I’m keen to get some in the book, but to me things seem a bit more hazy than this time last year.

                    I like to perm a handful of horses with solid chances and targets regardless of price… who gets your vote?

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                    • Originally posted by DeeBee View Post
                      Who does everyone think is the most solid looking double/handful of doubles at the current prices (ignoring what you may have on already)

                      as a doubles man I’m keen to get some in the book, but to me things seem a bit more hazy than this time last year.

                      I like to perm a handful of horses with solid chances and targets regardless of price… who gets your vote?
                      Bob Olinger / Marsh
                      Appreciate It / Arkle
                      Honeysuckle / Champion Hurdle

                      Are the 3 I’ve been playing the doubles and trixie with. Pretty boring but hopefully strong picks

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                      • Originally posted by DeeBee View Post
                        Who does everyone think is the most solid looking double/handful of doubles at the current prices (ignoring what you may have on already)

                        as a doubles man I’m keen to get some in the book, but to me things seem a bit more hazy than this time last year.

                        I like to perm a handful of horses with solid chances and targets regardless of price… who gets your vote?
                        I've gone with

                        Elimay - Mares Chase
                        Galopin Des Champs - RSA
                        Run Wild Fred - NHC

                        "Journeys to Glory, breathing in his head".

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                        • If you are looking specifically for solid chances and more importantly targets set in stone then I can only think of Shishkin and Monkfish. Not very original I know.

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                          • This year compared to last year is a nightmare to pin down horses to a specific race, last year a lot of horses were jumping out at me ! I've got opinions on where horses will go but no great confidence, the poor prices on twar markets don't help, either.

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                            • Originally posted by Ice View Post
                              This year compared to last year is a nightmare to pin down horses to a specific race, last year a lot of horses were jumping out at me !.
                              I think the loss of racing after Cheltenham last year prevented trainers from getting runs into unraced horses and from bumper horses making their hurdle debuts, and no doubt a few horses that weren’t stepped up in trip.
                              We won’t have realised it at the time but Cheltenham 2021 was a unique year with the best chance punters will ever have of striking gold, and as you say 2022 looks alot trickier !

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                              • Originally posted by Lobos View Post
                                If you are looking specifically for solid chances and more importantly targets set in stone then I can only think of Shishkin and Monkfish. Not very original I know.
                                Already have some 21/22 with these 2 so not really ones to include, but I agree, in terms of targets these are the only ones you’d be saying are safe at this point. I think elimay should go back to the mares chase and honeysuckle CH but I can’t be adding her at current prices.

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