Cheltenham Handicap Shortlists

[Scooby91]

Tower bridge is doing the same as glenloe

[Kevloaf]

Tower bridge is doing the same as glenloe

Yeah, could do with a price for him really.

[Kevloaf]

I have this bet as well. I also did a Trixie with Sire Du Berlais in the Pertemps. Very speculative but you never know.....

Thinking about a trixie but perhaps something much more solid and non-handicap

[Rhinestone_Cowboy]

According to the BHA ratings database, The Storyteller doesn't have an official mark over here. In Ireland he's gone up to 160 for chasing but, again, the hurdle mark of 142 seems to have lapsed.
For me that means that the UK handicapper can start from scratch using whatever evidence he chooses. As a baseline I'd expect him to use the 147 that he was allotted for the chase last season and allowed him to win by 1.5 lengths which put him up to 155. It's very much up to the new guy but I'd be surprised if he gets in with less than 150.

That’s interesting Archie and I would think not great news for those of us hoping the Storyteller wil be well in. The key piece of info for me (and I’m no expert) is that his Irish hurdle rating of 142 has elapsed. The hope being that that number (142) would have been used as a basis. Does anyone know why this is? I assume due to the amount of time since his last hurdle race. Had a cursory look online but found zilch.

[mayo]

Tower bridge is doing the same as glenloe

One of these two or Jerrysback for the Ultima ?

Owners stats via Charlie

Ultima
11 / 2 / 3 / 1
2 winners
2012 - Alfie Sherrin 14/1
2009 - Wichita Lineman 5/1f

[archie]

That’s interesting Archie and I would think not great news for those of us hoping the Storyteller wil be well in. The key piece of info for me (and I’m no expert) is that his Irish hurdle rating of 142 has elapsed. The hope being that that number (142) would have been used as a basis. Does anyone know why this is? I assume due to the amount of time since his last hurdle race. Had a cursory look online but found zilch.

I can't work out where the 142 originated. Was it maybe the rating for the Martin Pipe that he didn't get to? I've assumed it was an Irish mark given when/if he had a G1 or handicap entry but, on reflection, it may be a one-off UK mark. I'd say that if you don't actually run in a handicap your starter mark is treated as a one-off open to revision and the mark is only permanent when you do get that handicap run to test it.
Obviously, I hope I'm wrong and that he does get 142 plus the UK 'bonus' but I wouldn't want to commit too much money on that assumption.

[Scooby91]

I can't work out where the 142 originated. Was it maybe the rating for the Martin Pipe that he didn't get to? I've assumed it was an Irish mark given when/if he had a G1 or handicap entry but, on reflection, it may be a one-off UK mark. I'd say that if you don't actually run in a handicap your starter mark is treated as a one-off open to revision and the mark is only permanent when you do get that handicap run to test it.
Obviously, I hope I'm wrong and that he does get 142 plus the UK 'bonus' but I wouldn't want to commit too much money on that assumption.

They entered him up for a handicap hurdle over here to check his mark before the martin pipe. That was/ is his UK mark.

Same as eclair de beaufeu / Dallas des pictons this year.

[Faugheen_Machine]

They entered him up for a handicap hurdle over here to check his mark before the martin pipe. That was/ is his UK mark.

Same as eclair de beaufeu / Dallas des pictons this year.

He also ran over hurdles in November 2017 so I can't understand the OR of 142 not being valid.

[jack1092]

BHA and HRI don't have ratings for him on their site now...that i can see so maybe they have elapsed?

[archie]

They entered him up for a handicap hurdle over here to check his mark before the martin pipe. That was/ is his UK mark.

Same as eclair de beaufeu / Dallas des pictons this year.

Cheers. Hard to believe that they'll stick with that two years on but fingers crossed for those who are already on.

[JackieMoon33]

I can't work out where the 142 originated. Was it maybe the rating for the Martin Pipe that he didn't get to? I've assumed it was an Irish mark given when/if he had a G1 or handicap entry but, on reflection, it may be a one-off UK mark. I'd say that if you don't actually run in a handicap your starter mark is treated as a one-off open to revision and the mark is only permanent when you do get that handicap run to test it.
Obviously, I hope I'm wrong and that he does get 142 plus the UK 'bonus' but I wouldn't want to commit too much money on that assumption.

I’m pretty sure he was injured after the initial weights were out so the rating was official at the time.

And just seen an article that he was a general 4/1 shot at the time he was pulled.

[Quevega]

I’m pretty sure he was injured after the initial weights were out so the rating was official at the time.

And just seen an article that he was a general 4/1 shot at the time he was pulled.

that all rings a bell with me. I was on at 16's I think and he was consistently backed till the injury announcement and gordon was giving it large in preview evenings.
Once weights are out this year for coral cup, assuming they';re favourable, I reckon we'll get the same mantra.

[jono]

I’m pretty sure he was injured after the initial weights were out so the rating was official at the time.

And just seen an article that he was a general 4/1 shot at the time he was pulled.

Elliott also quoted in the weeks leading up to the festival that year that The Storyteller was his best handicapped horse (off 142)

[jack1092]

Just received this off HRI, whom i emailed for confirmation:


Hi Mr Houston,

Many thanks for your email with regard to The Storyteller. The horse, as you say, last ran off 142 when runner up at Fairyhouse in November 2017 before embarking on a chasing career and following his run when third in the Irish Gold Cup at Leopardstown on Sunday, he is now rated 160 over fences. However, if he was to return to hurdling, it is very likely that he would be able to run off 142 although it is the handicapper's prerogative as to which rating he uses (it is possible that he could up his rating by a couple of pounds but it certainly would not be near his chase rating). Unlike the UK, his rating over hurdles would not be moved up to 160 automatically which I believe is the rule over there.

Hope this is of some help to you,

Regards and thanks
Horse Racing Ireland
Entry & Declarations Department


Damn, hope he's wrong but can't see it!

[Rhinestone_Cowboy]

Just received this off HRI, whom i emailed for confirmation:


Hi Mr Houston,

Many thanks for your email with regard to The Storyteller. The horse, as you say, last ran off 142 when runner up at Fairyhouse in November 2017 before embarking on a chasing career and following his run when third in the Irish Gold Cup at Leopardstown on Sunday, he is now rated 160 over fences. However, if he was to return to hurdling, it is very likely that he would be able to run off 142 although it is the handicapper's prerogative as to which rating he uses (it is possible that he could up his rating by a couple of pounds but it certainly would not be near his chase rating). Unlike the UK, his rating over hurdles would not be moved up to 160 automatically which I believe is the rule over there.

Hope this is of some help to you,

Regards and thanks
Horse Racing Ireland
Entry & Declarations Department


Damn, hope he's wrong but can't see it!

Legend .... haha! It would be good to know though why the 142 does not show on the ratings website? As where is the UK handicapper going to find this 142 rating to use as a basis?

Just realised I might have interpreted this different to you Jack. Are you saying ‘damn’ because you think he is saying that the UK handicapper will put him up to his Chase mark? No idea if that is correct but I read that as for UK horses only