Arkle/Marsh/RSA/NH Chase - Novice Chasers 2021 (new)

[Ray]

Only way to play envoi now is to do a euro sunday football shopping list ending with him!

[Can't Catch Me]

I'd always have Vautour as a superstar as well. Bloody loved that horse! Bar the surprise defeat at Christmas, he was operating at the same level for me. EA going to have to go some to better his Marsh performance!

[Faugheen_Machine]

Agree.


You just can't pick holes.



He's blown the Samcro hype train that we were all aboard out of the water. ****Why would a train be in the water?***



I got in to racing when Kauto Star was already at the top... this seems to be the first genuine super star over jumps since then?

Samcro was on the right path for a while, maybe Douvan too?



This horse is just special. Even if his jumping was below average, I still think he'd win Grade 1's, the speed he covers the ground looks effortless between fences.



Today's race was a non-event really as they skipped loads of fences too, but it's impossible to pick a hole in him?

He's already the best national hunt in training, imo.

He's obviously pivotal to my Cheltenham, so I may be biased, (and I'll have to protect my position at some point) but it's difficult to see what would beat him off he didn't suffer a mishap.

[Kevloaf]

Sprinter Sacre?

Envoi Allen has been fav every race of his life, and won every race of his life so far.

Sprinter definitely worthy of mention though yeah, just adds to the point really, he's up there with some of the greatest I've seen already, and I think he may end up the best!

Still has it to do of course, but by golly it's exciting!

[Kevloaf]

I'd always have Vautour as a superstar as well. Bloody loved that horse! Bar the surprise defeat at Christmas, he was operating at the same level for me. EA going to have to go some to better his Marsh performance!

Yeah he was a superstar too, but beaten by Cue Card and winning the Ryanair take away from his legacy a bit.... Envoi can usurp him on this trajectory?

[Topofthegame2021]

Court maid impressive there... national hunt chase maybe?

[Can't Catch Me]

Yeah he was a superstar too, but beaten by Cue Card and winning the Ryanair take away from his legacy a bit.... Envoi can usurp him on this trajectory?

Yes agree... EA can 100% usurp him!

[Kevloaf]

If Altior doesn't fit that bill then I don't know what a horse has to do to get there...

Yeah Altior another one who deserves to be mentioned..... the fact Min was the fav means he still falls short of what Envoi Allen has done so far in their careers to date?




Obviously there is no real point to what I'm saying, I'm not trying to knock any of these super star horses we've had over the last 10 years (Thistlecrack another)...... but I just think what Envoi Allen is doing is going to potentially put him AHEAD of all these horses we're naming..... which is exciting!

[ryanh97]

Yeah Altior another one who deserves to be mentioned..... the fact Min was the fav means he still falls short of what Envoi Allen has done so far in their careers to date?




Obviously there is no real point to what I'm saying, I'm not trying to knock any of these super star horses we've had over the last 10 years (Thistlecrack another)...... but I just think what Envoi Allen is doing is going to potentially put him AHEAD of all these horses we're naming..... which is exciting!

Agree, will likely be unbeaten when arriving at the Gold cup, only followed racing for 6 years or so but can't imagine there'll be many recently on that level?

[Topofthegame2021]

Lieutenant Rocco has been priced up on 365 @ 999/1.

not sure what that’s about but I had 50p on it lol

[Kevloaf]

Agree, will likely be unbeaten when arriving at the Gold cup, only followed racing for 6 years or so but can't imagine there'll be many recently on that level?

Altior closest but did lose in a bumper.

[Spectre]

Just back to the Mullins novice chaser debate for a moment, I suspect Willie will be trying to hold Gordon off for the Irish trainers title come March, and I suspect he may hold some of his nice horses back for Ireland rather than go in double or triple-handed in the graded races. Worth bearing in mind I think.

[Kevloaf]

Just back to the Mullins novice chaser debate for a moment, I suspect Willie will be trying to hold Gordon off for the Irish trainers title come March, and I suspect he may hold some of his nice horses back for Ireland rather than go in double or triple-handed in the graded races. Worth bearing in mind I think.

Has he ever done that before?

All his potential Cheltenham winners will be on the boat (as usual) then he'll just throw them all in the Irish races like normal, complete scatter gun approach, mopping up as much prize money as he can?



There might be the odd horse with a specific target, but I think he's equally concerned that Gordon is a genuine threat at Cheltenham for the leading trainer to be leaving horses at home.

Asterion Forglonge likely...can't think of many others?

[Spectre]

He potentially has 2, 3, or even 4 horses for some of the novice chases, and I can see horses like Energumene being left at home for example. It’s a long old season and he’ll be needing to mop up at Punchestown. I suspect with Gordon being in the best position he’s had so far to snatch the trainers title for the first time, Willie will attach more importance to defending that than possibly being tied 6-6 at Cheltenham and losing on count back because he didn’t run multiple novice chasers.

[Istabraq]

Yep, comparing generations is never easy and there’s never a right answer, enjoying what we have now is what it’s all about, sincerely hope Envoi Allen does what he’s doing for years to come...